tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4718120950252476804.post2884505298698389991..comments2023-12-28T09:21:30.579-05:00Comments on Adam Holland: Hate cult visits Brooklyn, part deuxAdam Hollandhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/06245468599571473818noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4718120950252476804.post-29220198831572672672009-10-01T00:33:21.324-04:002009-10-01T00:33:21.324-04:00I guess the real harm would be to children exposed...I guess the real harm would be to children exposed to this. I mean Jewish children who see these people humiliating them and having their parents explain why. I don't have children of my own, but I've noticed now and then that parents tend to want to shield their kids from this prejudice, even if they know that the kids will inevitably have to confront it later in life.<br /><br />JoanneAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4718120950252476804.post-77527181165108768452009-09-30T20:30:18.054-04:002009-09-30T20:30:18.054-04:00Joanne:
Everything you say is true, so let me exp...Joanne:<br /><br />Everything you say is true, so let me explain to you why I am still concerned about this group. <br /><br />First, in every angry crowd there is an individual unhinged enough to cross the line between hate speech and violence. I remember an instance here in Brooklyn when a dispute over a white girl dating a black guy escalated to the point where a mob confronted the guy as he exited a subway station. One unhinged member of the mob shot the guy, thinking he was doing what the mob wanted. And in a way he did, although they may not have known of his plans. That sort of thing is what this group reminds me of. That's why I laugh at them less than some do, although I understand that sentiment as well. <br /><br />This all was brought into focus for me by the obscenities the group out on their website calendar addressing the girl celebrating her bat mitzvah at Beth Elohim on the day of the demonstration. Any group which dehumanizes others to that extent -- subjecting innocent 13 year old girls to that sort of abuse -- is certainly creating an atmosphere where one of their members could lash out against Jews or gays thinking God was on his side.<br /><br />Secondly, this group poisons the atmosphere in the country at large. They create a template for other crazies to follow. To those so inclined, they inspire imitators. They degrade the discourse. Worst of all, they force their disgraceful, disgusting imagery and language into our collective consciousness, including that of our children. <br /><br />You are right; they aren't going to win many converts, if any at all. They won't win elections. They are on some sort of sick, pointless ego trip. But they definitely harm us and they should stop it.Adam Hollandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06245468599571473818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4718120950252476804.post-79013928021340447992009-09-30T19:04:17.869-04:002009-09-30T19:04:17.869-04:00Granted, Adam, a small group of crazies can do a l...Granted, Adam, a small group of crazies can do a lot of damage, but 100 people are just 100 people. That's why their activities are less worrying to me than, say, a move toward divestment by the Presbyterian Church. Phelps's church has less reach and infinitely less prestige.<br /><br />Also, I think such marginal groups can have an effect only when the overall political climate is conducive to it. Such groups can't create that kind of climate, but the savvier among them can exploit it (think Hitler's Nazis during Weimar).<br /><br />JoanneAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4718120950252476804.post-62144192196547794562009-09-30T12:16:09.735-04:002009-09-30T12:16:09.735-04:00Joanne:
Thanks for your comment. I hear what you...Joanne:<br /><br />Thanks for your comment. I hear what you're saying, but it <i>is</i> a sort of church. My understanding is that they have about 100 hundred members and that about half are Phelps family members. If you have any doubts about how seriously they take this, you should check out their websites to see just how well organized and committed to this they are.<br /><br />In researching the far-right, I've run across a number of this type of unaffiliated or loosely affiliated church of similar size, although none other which attract this amount of publicity. Several which spring to mind also focus on anti-Semitism and homophobia.<br /><br />The WBC have the strange combination of being both unusual insular and unusual public. Weird. This is part of why I take them to be a serious threat, in spite of their obviously ludicrous public face. They are true believers in hate and crave publicity with a literally religious fervor. That combination should be viewed as posing a real threat, no matter how absurd their image.<br /><br />One last thought: history has shown that "a small bunch of nut cases" can do a great deal of damage.Adam Hollandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06245468599571473818noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4718120950252476804.post-51922586518609844412009-09-30T11:49:04.227-04:002009-09-30T11:49:04.227-04:00The answer is clear: They aren't a church. Tha...The answer is clear: They aren't a church. That's just to give them some credibility. They're a small bunch of nut cases with too much time on their hands. Pure and simple.<br /><br />JoanneAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4718120950252476804.post-8727898830526665222009-09-29T21:13:36.972-04:002009-09-29T21:13:36.972-04:00So of course I clicked the pdf.
One phrase stood ...So of course I clicked the pdf.<br /><br />One phrase stood out: 'anathema maranatha'.<br /><br />From Wikipedia:<br />Maranatha (either מרנא תא; maranâ' thâ' or מרן אתא; maran 'athâ' ) is an Aramaic phrase occurring once only in the New Testament and also in the Didache which is part of the Apostolic Fathers' collection. It is transliterated into Greek letters rather than translated, and is found at the end of Paul's First Epistle to the Corinthians (1 Cor 16:22) as part of a curse. <br /><br />The NRSV translates it as: "Our Lord, come!" but notes that it could also be translated as: "Our Lord has come"; the NIV translates: "Come, O Lord"; the NAB notes:<br /><br />"As understood here ("O Lord, come!"), it is a prayer for the early return of xxxxxx. If the Aramaic words are divided differently (Maran atha, "Our Lord has come"), it becomes a credal declaration. The former interpretation is supported by what appears to be a Greek equivalent of this acclamation in Rev 22:20 "Amen. Come, Lord xxxxxx!"" <br />The phrase may have been used as a greeting between Early Christians,[1] and it is possibly in this way that it was used by the Apostle Paul.<br /><br />That was fascinating.<br /><br />-------------------------------<br /><br />Glad to hear that a good time was had by all. And that everybody behaved with aplomb and dignity.<br /><br />Well, except the Topekans, of course. But probably no one expected aplomb and dignity from them in any case.The back of the hillhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05564245223453467132noreply@blogger.com